Ah, at last some mentions the real problem. It is not the calibre but the barrel length which constitutes the problem. Australia and the UK has not noticed much of a problem with their 5.56x45mm calibre rifles as far as the calibre goes in Afghanistan, only the US forces, because they use a short carbine and wonder why they can't hit anything.
Sir John Valentine Carden Survives. Part 2.
- Thread starter allanpcameron
- Start date
Both the British and Australians use bullpups (the F88 Austeyr and L85A2 respectively), so they can be shorter than the M4 (at least when the latter has the stock extended), but still maintain the 20" barrel.
Exactly! How to maintain your barrel length in a shorter rifle. I have fired the F88 Austeyr and been able to hit targets at 300m or more ranges with ease. I am completely dumbfounded that the US Army is unable to work out that the problem is not the calibre but the barrel length of the pipsqueak M4.
I don't want to derail a side, off-thread discussion, but: what machine guns did the Red Army use in their Lend-Lease tanks?
Well they used the DT in all of their own tanks, so probably that one?
Usually what ever it was provided with.
I know the US tanks came fully equipped as they would be issued to the US Army including submachine guns for the crew.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that the Lend-Lease Tanks came with their Machine Guns as well- so the BESA for the British stuff, M1919 and M2 for the American ones.
Ofc, Soldiers are soldiers and have forever been soldiers, so it wouldn't surprise me if there were some Soviet LL Tanks with some additional DTs strapped on somehow.
11 March 1942. Mindoro, Philippines.
allanpcameron
Donor
11 March 1942. Mindoro, Philippines.
With the fall of Bataan, the need to evacuate General Douglas MacArthur, his family and others VIPs from the Philippines had become urgent. While the final battles on Bataan were taking place, MacArthur’s group were evacuated on 8 March by a number of PT boats, initially to Mindoro. The original plan to take the General to Mindanao to be evacuated by air had proven too difficult to organise. The B17s had been used extensively and most were in need of replacement.
The dispatch of four B17s from Darwin to Mindanao had resulted in only one reaching the landing strip, and being judged unsafe to carry the VIPs. The question of when more suitable aircraft would be available was judged to be too long. President Roosevelt had ordered MacArthur out of the Philippines on 22 February and this order was reiterated again on 9 March. It was estimated that suitable aircraft wouldn’t be available until 16 March, and Washington would not countenance the delay any longer.
The two British submarines, HMS Porpoise and Rorqual, had been back and forth from Singapore, bringing in tons of supplies and evacuating as many specialists and wounded as possible. In addition to the American submarines doing the same, it was felt that MacArthur’s evacuation by submarine would be the safest way.
When informed of this, the General could not agree to be evacuated by the Royal Navy, it would have to be a USN submarine or nothing. USS Permit, having already evacuated Admiral Thomas Hart, was tasked with collecting the General and his party. The two Royal Navy Submarines would take turns to enter Corregidor and rescue as many people as they could. USS Permit would have the less hazardous collection of MacArthur’s party from San Jose on Mindoro.
Having sailed from San Jose during the night of 10/11 March, USS Permit’s captain, Lieutenant Commander Adrian Hurst, had planned to follow the same route he’d taken Admiral Hart to Surabaya, from where he could be flown to Australia. The last radio report from USS Permit was received at 22:00hrs, reporting they had been damaged by depth charges and had to surface. The radio message ended abruptly. General MacArthur, his family, staff and the crew of USS Permit were posted missing, believed killed in action.
With the fall of Bataan, the need to evacuate General Douglas MacArthur, his family and others VIPs from the Philippines had become urgent. While the final battles on Bataan were taking place, MacArthur’s group were evacuated on 8 March by a number of PT boats, initially to Mindoro. The original plan to take the General to Mindanao to be evacuated by air had proven too difficult to organise. The B17s had been used extensively and most were in need of replacement.
The dispatch of four B17s from Darwin to Mindanao had resulted in only one reaching the landing strip, and being judged unsafe to carry the VIPs. The question of when more suitable aircraft would be available was judged to be too long. President Roosevelt had ordered MacArthur out of the Philippines on 22 February and this order was reiterated again on 9 March. It was estimated that suitable aircraft wouldn’t be available until 16 March, and Washington would not countenance the delay any longer.
The two British submarines, HMS Porpoise and Rorqual, had been back and forth from Singapore, bringing in tons of supplies and evacuating as many specialists and wounded as possible. In addition to the American submarines doing the same, it was felt that MacArthur’s evacuation by submarine would be the safest way.
When informed of this, the General could not agree to be evacuated by the Royal Navy, it would have to be a USN submarine or nothing. USS Permit, having already evacuated Admiral Thomas Hart, was tasked with collecting the General and his party. The two Royal Navy Submarines would take turns to enter Corregidor and rescue as many people as they could. USS Permit would have the less hazardous collection of MacArthur’s party from San Jose on Mindoro.
Having sailed from San Jose during the night of 10/11 March, USS Permit’s captain, Lieutenant Commander Adrian Hurst, had planned to follow the same route he’d taken Admiral Hart to Surabaya, from where he could be flown to Australia. The last radio report from USS Permit was received at 22:00hrs, reporting they had been damaged by depth charges and had to surface. The radio message ended abruptly. General MacArthur, his family, staff and the crew of USS Permit were posted missing, believed killed in action.
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I know with MacArthur the actual limits of authority are somewhat nebulous, but would he have the ability to overrule the skipper on his own ship? I understand that on ship the ultimate authority rests with the captain, even in the presence of more senior officers. Particularly when the limits of fuel and safe passage make other options more attractive.
Technically no, the captain of the boat has the right to tell him to fuck off and walk if he doesn't like it.
Realistically, that's easier said than done when there's a General throwing a tantrum in front of you and not every officer would feel comfortable with telling a General to poke it.
Eh Hurst should have told to MacArthur to sod off, no one tells the Captain how to run his ship or boat. Well not unless you want the crew and nearby officers to educate them. Heck he probably want to avoid the RN subs because stupid badtard would be told to piss up a rope to an officer who went through the Perisher.
Stupid Bastard MacArthur killed his family and Hurst killed his crew, though if he is dead well there goes the Republican Parties Darling and a major headache for Roosevelt.
Edit: Looking FWD to RampRats take on this.
Stupid Bastard MacArthur killed his family and Hurst killed his crew, though if he is dead well there goes the Republican Parties Darling and a major headache for Roosevelt.
Edit: Looking FWD to RampRats take on this.
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As much as we all like creative ways of killing MacArthur, I tend to agree with those who say this wouldn’t happen. MacArthur would shout and bluster, the captain would listen (politely, at least at first) then take the action he deemed necessary to comply with his orders whilst preserving his boat and his crew. Besides, how is MacArthur going to know different until it’s too late?
Ramp-Rat
Monthly Donor
I am going to have to take some time to consider just what my thoughts on this latest post are, however I will at this time say one thing, while normally the captain of a ship is lord and master. The combination of MacArthur in full flow, and just how junior the officer is, basically he's the equivalent of a captain in the Army, could result in him bowing to Mac, much against his better judgement.
RR.
RR.
