[Ottoman AH] - Ottomans expel all Greeks post Greek Independence War

Droman

This includes Cyprus. Your thoughts as to consequences, repercussions, etc... if the Ottomans expel all their remaining Greek citizenry to Greece proper?

Edit: Or if you prefer, it's constructed into the treaty as part of the agreement. Greeks go to Greece, Muslims go to Ottoman Empire.
 
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Koprulu Mustafa Pasha

Koprulu Mustafa Pasha

Gone Fishin'
Droman said:
This includes Cyprus. Your thoughts as to consequences, repercussions, etc... if the Ottomans expel all their remaining Greek citizenry to Greece proper?
Click to expand...

Not too good for the economy. And I can't tell how the Great Powers would react to it, possibly not too happy. Especially Russia.
 
Skallagrim

Skallagrim

Banned
"Would you look at that," Great Britain said. "The Ottomans, whom we vaguely hate in this period-typical racist way of ours, are acting cruelly against the valiant Greeks we've just spent some considerable effort romanticising and glorifying. This looks like just the excuse we need to smash the Turks and grab up all the important bits before the Russians can nab them up."

"One moment," France cut it. "We have some interests in that part of the world as well. Let's solidify our post-Napoleonic alliance and do this thing together."

"Friends!" Austria-Hungary yelled from the far side of the room. "We, too, feel committed to the concert of Europe. Also, we have long-standing designs on the Balkans. We're on board with this plan!"

"This doesn't look good," Russia muttered. "We can either fight a war against basically all major powers, or we can join the inevitable and grab up a lot of North-Eastern Anatolia. Let's do the latter, it seems endlessly more productive."
 
Cuāuhtemōc

Cuāuhtemōc

Banned
The Ottoman Empire essentially signs its death wish and gets promptly thrashed by every European power and many people will end up dying. The Turks would be lucky if they're able to hold onto Anatolia once France, Britain, Austria and Russia are done with it.
 
Koprulu Mustafa Pasha

Koprulu Mustafa Pasha

Gone Fishin'
Cuāuhtemōc said:
The Ottoman Empire essentially signs its death wish and gets promptly thrashed by every European power and many people will end up dying. The Turks would be lucky if they're able to hold onto Anatolia once France, Britain, Austria and Russia are done with it.
Click to expand...

The only nation remotely to close to threaten the empire is Russian and possibly Britain. But the thing is, no mattet how pissed off they'll be, they won't let Russia have most of the cake. The balance of power still matters. Possibly ripping off more land but still.
 

Halagaz

You couldn't put all the Greeks into Greece - it was far too small. Many of them would probably go to Wallachia, Moldavia, Serbia, Russia, western Europe...and establish large emigre communities there.

Consequences? Well, the resulting economic catastrophe probably makes a complete joke out of any Ottoman reform attempts. The Ottoman Empire takes the "sick man of Europe" thing to a whole new level, limps along for a decade or two, and is destroyed in like the first major crisis.
Assuming that it isn't immediately destroyed by huge rebellions and Great Power intervention.

There's also the problem: just who is a Greek? The Ottoman state generally thought and operated in terms of millets. The Greek (or rather, "Rum") millet included all Orthodox Christians at this point.
 

Droman

Halagaz said:
There's also the problem: just who is a Greek? The Ottoman state generally thought and operated in terms of millets. The Greek (or rather, "Rum") millet included all Orthodox Christians at this point.
Click to expand...
We'll say Orthodox Christians in Europe and Anatolia for the purpose of the WI.
 

EMT

Beyond the literally impossible in the physical sense, the economic destruction sense, the impossibly stupid as an idea sense, political suicide as an action sense, the Ottomans would never do this because of the Greek communities that stayed loyal throughout the rest of the Empire or IIRC in a few cases, actively fought against the Greek independence movement. Been a while since I did any reading on the topic but even from an internal politics standpoint, it's pants on head idiotic.
 

funnyhat

The European powers temporarily forget about their differences and attack the Ottomans from multiple directions. The Ottomans cannot resist.

Rumelia/Anatolia are partitioned, after a conference is held to settle boundaries. Deciding who controls Constantinople is tough. Perhaps it goes to the new Greek state as a compromise. The conference leaves most parties unsatisfied.

Meanwhile, the Arabs profit from this opportunity to break away and form new states. But the question of the Levant remains. It has fallen under Arab control in the tumult but Europeans do not want to lose a chance at Jerusalem. There is talk of a new Crusade for control of the Holy Land - but the Europeans are even more undecided about what to do with it if they are successful...
 
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Escape Zeppelin

funnyhat said:
Rumelia/Anatolia are partitioned, after a conference is held to settle boundaries. Deciding who controls Constantinople is tough. Perhaps it goes to the new Greek state as a compromise. The conference leaves most parties unsatisfied.

Meanwhile, the Arabs profit from this opportunity to break away and form new states. But the question of the Levant remains. It has fallen under Arab control in the tumult but Europeans do not want to lose a chance at Jerusalem. There is talk of a new Crusade for control of the Holy Land - but the Europeans are even more undecided about what to do with it if they are successful...
Click to expand...

Giving Constantinople to the Greeks seems most plausible considering the cause of the partition and the Greeks will be more palatable to everybody than one of the great powers. Plus the city at the time had a very significant Greek population.

Because of logistics the Levant is probably grabbed by Britain or France initially and is ruled indirectly via a nominally independent monarchy like Jordan or Iraq later were in our history. One nation ruling it directly would probably be a bridge too far for any of the other great powers in that period. Plus, establishing an "independant" Levant would be a good public relations move. "Opening Jerusalem up to all Christian faiths" kind of thing. Who would qualify as an acceptable monarch is an entirely different question though. Maybe a young Prince Albert?

It seems likely that several states of varying degrees of independence come out of the former Ottoman territory outside Anatolia.
 

Hvalrossen

Droman said:
This includes Cyprus. Your thoughts as to consequences, repercussions, etc... if the Ottomans expel all their remaining Greek citizenry to Greece proper?

Edit: Or if you prefer, it's constructed into the treaty as part of the agreement. Greeks go to Greece, Muslims go to Ottoman Empire.
Click to expand...
Probably a larger Greek diaspora.
 

Byzantion

Droman said:
This includes Cyprus. Your thoughts as to consequences, repercussions, etc... if the Ottomans expel all their remaining Greek citizenry to Greece proper?

Edit: Or if you prefer, it's constructed into the treaty as part of the agreement. Greeks go to Greece, Muslims go to Ottoman Empire.
Click to expand...

Greek immigration to America ? Couls even see a larger community in Orthodox Ethiopia than OTL . OTL there had been a exiled Ottoman Greek community that persisted until the Derg regime in 1975 and ist even there today in very small numbers.
 
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