OTL the Doolittle raid took place about 3 weeks after the Indian Ocean Raid started. If the Japanese are ready to go around the same time as they were historically, and I see no reason why they wouldn't be give or take then there is good chance that the RN and IJN are having a battle around the time the Doolittle raid goes in.
Sir John Valentine Carden Survives. Part 2.
- Thread starter allanpcameron
- Start date
Hm, the longer the Japanese do stick around in the southern part of the SCS, the greater the chance they get torpedoed.
True but what other option do they have. The IJN will have to get involved against at least one of the fleets at some point. The longer they wait to attack the RN and Singapore the harder such an attack will be. Going east to face the Americans leaves their rear open to a close force, going west to deal with the British has a smaller risk given the relative distances involved.
Going west has a greater chance of being spotted. And the British torpedoes work perfectly.
The Japanese probably don’t know about the latter. But they definitely do know about the former.
Arguably it still makes “more sense” from an IJN perspective for the Kido Butai to go into the Pacific tocut the USN off from Australia. Especially with these new American reinforcements landing. This will also make sense if they lost a painful percentage of their aircraft on the Soerobaya Raid.
Provided the Japanese have the oil.
EDIT: On the flip side, the kill claims of the IJN aviators could probably convince those higher up that “one more push” would destroy the ABDACOM Fleet. We may even see a Battle of Britain re-run
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Ramp-Rat
Monthly Donor
Do British Torpedoes work perfectly, it would be much better be said, as some British Torpedoes worked well, while some required work done upon them. The majority of ship and submarine launched torpedoes worked well, and the few problems with them had been fixed by the end of 1940. However the air launched torpedoes, especially those with magnetic detonators had some serious problems, and it took until late in 1941, for the majority of them to be resolved. The major advantage that the British had, was that their establishment was more responsive to complaints from the end users, unlike the Americans. And by 1941, they had had significant experience in torpedo use under war time conditions in various areas, with multiple reports finding their way back, from both training and combat.
RR.
24 February 1942. Butterworth, Malaya
allanpcameron
Donor
24 February 1942. Butterworth, Malaya
When the 6 Division Cavalry Regiment had returned from North Africa and been redesignated as 8 Division Cavalry Regiment, they had been used to making do with whatever was at hand. Starting off with universal carriers, a few light tanks, even horses for a time, they’d taken ownership of some Italian tanks and tankettes which had managed to fool the Italians long enough to capture Tobruk.
The Regiment’s Light Aid Detachment and workshop, recently arrived at Butterworth, had plenty of experience of being inventive in fixing up all sorts of broken vehicles, and the M3 Stuart tanks had taken plenty of work to keep them on the road. One of the effects of the battles around Ipoh had been trying to figure out ways of winkling out Japanese units from all sorts of dugouts and protected positions. Much of the work had been done by the infantry with a variety of explosive devices.
When the Australians had been running about in Italian tanks, they’d had the chance to examine a CV33 flame-throwing tankette. It was something they’d all be glad not to be on the receiving end of it, but the idea had been floated as a possible solution to digging out the Japanese. Quite a few Japanese flamethrowers had been captured and these had been examined and tested. The range of the Type 100 flame was a maximum of 30 yards. A couple of the Japanese flamethrowers had been sent back to Singapore to be examined to see if they could be copied, even improved upon. The idea was simple enough to copy though there were different opinions about the best way of increasing the range.
The fact that the flamethrowers seemed to be issued to Japanese engineers, had become a matter of debate about how best to use them. The Australians had, not unusually, kept a couple for themselves. The weight of the whole unit, when loaded was just under 60lbs, which the men agreed was too heavy for general use. Those that’d been captured were designed as a backpack, but it could only be carried for short distances. Loading it onto a universal carrier was possible, a bit like the Italian tankette. They’d be able then to carry more fuel for it. The reality was that the universal carrier was still going to be too vulnerable.
One Stuart tank’s turret had been damaged and jammed too badly to be fixed locally. As usual the tank was being stripped of anything useful before being sent back for a full repair job. A couple of the mechanics, when they were removing the .30 hull machine gun, had suggested trying to put one of the captured flamethrowers in its place. The suggestion was taken to the OC of the workshop, who was happy to see whether or not it could be done. There was a fair bit of trepidation, no one liked the idea of putting something that flammable inside the tank.
A bit of inventive bodging got the flamethrower set up in place of the hull mounted machine gun, and it was tested successfully. The problem was that the tank would need to come within a very short range of a target to successfully engage it. The Stuart tank had proven to be vulnerable to all sorts of Japanese countermeasures (not least the use of flamethrowers). Putting it in a Matilda II would certainly provide the crew with extra protection, and it seemed that someone had already been thinking along those lines.
In the meantime, there wasn’t a great deal of the Japanese nitrogen to provide the pressure or the odd mixture of petrol and tar that they used as fuel. The Australians had some ideas about what could be used to pressurise the fuel and what would be the best mixture for the fuel itself. Nobody had much time to give it more thought, but back at Singapore the Royal Armoured Corps depot saw the report of the Australian tinkering and could see the advantages of having a few flame tanks in each tank battalion. A corner of one of the workshops became the ‘dragon den’, where more thought and tinkering went on. One of the men had taken to calling the fire projector ‘Smaug’ after the dragon in Tolkien’s novel ‘The Hobbit.’ The reports eventually found themselves in the hands of Major-General Percy Hobart and the Petroleum Warfare Department. In response the PWD sent notes on some of its work back to Singapore, allowing for more cross-fertilisation of the idea of giving the allies an effective flame tank.
When the 6 Division Cavalry Regiment had returned from North Africa and been redesignated as 8 Division Cavalry Regiment, they had been used to making do with whatever was at hand. Starting off with universal carriers, a few light tanks, even horses for a time, they’d taken ownership of some Italian tanks and tankettes which had managed to fool the Italians long enough to capture Tobruk.
The Regiment’s Light Aid Detachment and workshop, recently arrived at Butterworth, had plenty of experience of being inventive in fixing up all sorts of broken vehicles, and the M3 Stuart tanks had taken plenty of work to keep them on the road. One of the effects of the battles around Ipoh had been trying to figure out ways of winkling out Japanese units from all sorts of dugouts and protected positions. Much of the work had been done by the infantry with a variety of explosive devices.
When the Australians had been running about in Italian tanks, they’d had the chance to examine a CV33 flame-throwing tankette. It was something they’d all be glad not to be on the receiving end of it, but the idea had been floated as a possible solution to digging out the Japanese. Quite a few Japanese flamethrowers had been captured and these had been examined and tested. The range of the Type 100 flame was a maximum of 30 yards. A couple of the Japanese flamethrowers had been sent back to Singapore to be examined to see if they could be copied, even improved upon. The idea was simple enough to copy though there were different opinions about the best way of increasing the range.
The fact that the flamethrowers seemed to be issued to Japanese engineers, had become a matter of debate about how best to use them. The Australians had, not unusually, kept a couple for themselves. The weight of the whole unit, when loaded was just under 60lbs, which the men agreed was too heavy for general use. Those that’d been captured were designed as a backpack, but it could only be carried for short distances. Loading it onto a universal carrier was possible, a bit like the Italian tankette. They’d be able then to carry more fuel for it. The reality was that the universal carrier was still going to be too vulnerable.
One Stuart tank’s turret had been damaged and jammed too badly to be fixed locally. As usual the tank was being stripped of anything useful before being sent back for a full repair job. A couple of the mechanics, when they were removing the .30 hull machine gun, had suggested trying to put one of the captured flamethrowers in its place. The suggestion was taken to the OC of the workshop, who was happy to see whether or not it could be done. There was a fair bit of trepidation, no one liked the idea of putting something that flammable inside the tank.
A bit of inventive bodging got the flamethrower set up in place of the hull mounted machine gun, and it was tested successfully. The problem was that the tank would need to come within a very short range of a target to successfully engage it. The Stuart tank had proven to be vulnerable to all sorts of Japanese countermeasures (not least the use of flamethrowers). Putting it in a Matilda II would certainly provide the crew with extra protection, and it seemed that someone had already been thinking along those lines.
In the meantime, there wasn’t a great deal of the Japanese nitrogen to provide the pressure or the odd mixture of petrol and tar that they used as fuel. The Australians had some ideas about what could be used to pressurise the fuel and what would be the best mixture for the fuel itself. Nobody had much time to give it more thought, but back at Singapore the Royal Armoured Corps depot saw the report of the Australian tinkering and could see the advantages of having a few flame tanks in each tank battalion. A corner of one of the workshops became the ‘dragon den’, where more thought and tinkering went on. One of the men had taken to calling the fire projector ‘Smaug’ after the dragon in Tolkien’s novel ‘The Hobbit.’ The reports eventually found themselves in the hands of Major-General Percy Hobart and the Petroleum Warfare Department. In response the PWD sent notes on some of its work back to Singapore, allowing for more cross-fertilisation of the idea of giving the allies an effective flame tank.
Well the Japanese are really screwed aren't they, especially now that the Commonwealth army is now have detailed information in regards to their weapons, which mean it is only time before they could give a proper (while not over engineered enough to drain more resources than it need to be) response to their potential strategy.
Slightly out of topic, but considering the location and the time currently, would the Dalforce in the near term be involved any action in the frontline in Malaya?
Hmmm. Children's book published September 1937. Admittedly popular enough to keep emptying the shelves during rationing. The soldiers would be a little bit old have any fond memories to reference.
A flame throwing tank in that environment would have to be carefully used and guarded . It's effect on any Japanese defenses would be devastating but if it is set alight itself the damage to the Aussies would be serious. I think some where used on the various island campaigns but I don't recall if any were used in any of the OTL campaigns on Asia's mainland.
Derek Pullem
Donor
Given that the Canadians were quite enthusiastic about developing flamethrower AFV (Wasp, Badger) and the Australians were looking at the Matilda to create the Frog then given their co-operation TTL on the Jumbuck it would seem a no-brainer for a Jumbuck flamethrower option to be developed. Give it a cute name like Salamander 
I, for one, whole-heartedly endorse that choice of name. 😁Given that the Canadians were quite enthusiastic about developing flamethrower AFV (Wasp, Badger) and the Australians were looking at the Matilda to create the Frog then given their co-operation TTL on the Jumbuck it would seem a no-brainer for a Jumbuck flamethrower option to be developed. Give it a cute name like Salamander
They're talking about putting it in a Matilda, so they're thinking along the same lines.
American Stuart tank fitted with flame gun in use in April 1944 during the campaign on Bougainville.
Shermans were also fitted with lame guns.