How could've Trotsky took power?

[EasternRomanEmpire]

After the October Revolution and during the Russian Civil War, Trotsky was de facto Lenin's second-in-command. At multiple times Lenin offered Trotsky high positions which could've given him the power inside the party to outmanoeuvre Stalin (first deputy of Sovnarkom, Vice-Chairman of the Soviet Union ecc.) and it was likely Lenin's intention to nominate him his successor. Also after Lenin's testament came out Stalin offered to resign but Trotsky, among others, insisted that he remained.

How could've Trotsky made better decisions which would've resulted in him taking power instead of Stalin?

 

[Lalli]

Trotsky wasn't very popular and really trusted inside of Bolsheviks. Probably it would help if he joins much earlier. And Stalin dying during the civil war would help. But even then it might be uphill fight for Trotsky.

 

[jacob ningen]

Trotsky wasn't very popular and really trusted inside of Bolsheviks. Probably it would help if he joins much earlier. And Stalin dying during the civil war would help. But even then it might be uphill fight for Trotsky.

wasn't he a Menshevik in the famous Iskra editorial board vote?

 

[Lalli]

wasn't he a Menshevik in the famous Iskra editorial board vote?

Not sure bit if it was that way just find way him not join to Mensheviks.

 

[Bellacinos]

I think it would literally take Lenin living a few more years and announcing Trotsky verbally in a speech as his successor and Stalin either dying or being ousted from the party. Trotsky just wasn’t popular regardless of Stalin out maneuvering him.

 

[EasternRomanEmpire]

Trotsky wasn't very popular and really trusted inside of Bolsheviks. Probably it would help if he joins much earlier. And Stalin dying during the civil war would help. But even then it might be uphill fight for Trotsky.

The ones who wanted to be the leader of the USSR (mainly the members of the Politburo) wanted to remove Trotsky from power since he was an obstacle however he had enough support to be enough of a threat to force the formation of the Troika.

wasn't he a Menshevik in the famous Iskra editorial board vote?

He surprised everyone by joining the Mensheviks instead of the Bolsheviks during the split between the two, he later healed the split with Lenin and became the second most important person in Bolshevik Russia during the RCW.

I think it would literally take Lenin living a few more years and announcing Trotsky verbally in a speech as his successor and Stalin either dying or being ousted from the party. Trotsky just wasn’t popular regardless of Stalin out maneuvering him.

Stalin wasn't popular either(to be fair no one was, everybody wanted power for themselves), he used a position inside the party to come to power, Trotsky had been offered much more important positions than Stalin.

 

[Crueldwarf]

Trotsky primary issue was his personality and approach to relationships. He basically aggravated the entirety of higher echelon of the Bolshevik party by the end of the Civil War and so he had no real support base.
It is the reason why it was so easy for Stalin to remove him from power, while he had to work much harder to do the same with his other colleagues.

Basically, the best chance of Trostsky to remain in the top leadership of the USSR is prolonged life of both Felix Dzerchinsky and Mikhail Frunze which would (most likely) create a more collegial form of government in USSR instead of slow ascent of Stalin on top of everything. But Trotsky will not be in charge even in that scenario, he will simply be not exiled and will retain some high post.

 

[Mad Bad Rabbit]

I think it would literally take Lenin living a few more years and announcing Trotsky verbally in a speech as his successor and Stalin either dying or being ousted from the party.

[ cartoon of Stalin working at his desk while Mexican Costume Trotsky sneaks up behind him with a pickaxe... ]

 

[TheLastKnight]

Trotsky was popular with the Red Army, from his years as Commissar of War. Could he have just used his connections to launch a military coup?

 

[EasternRomanEmpire]

Trotsky was popular with the Red Army, from his years as Commissar of War. Could he have just used his connections to launch a military coup?

Probably but the problem is that there are generals which don't support him, the Cheka is against him, you have to do a coup in the middle of a Party Plenum so that everyone is present and legitimacy would be very low because of this.

 

[Parma]

After the October Revolution and during the Russian Civil War, Trotsky was de facto Lenin's second-in-command. At multiple times Lenin offered Trotsky high positions which could've given him the power inside the party to outmanoeuvre Stalin (first deputy of Sovnarkom, Vice-Chairman of the Soviet Union ecc.) and it was likely Lenin's intention to nominate him his successor. Also after Lenin's testament came out Stalin offered to resign but Trotsky, among others, insisted that he remained.

How could've Trotsky made better decisions which would've resulted in him taking power instead of Stalin?

Trotsky became the leader of the Sovjet Union in stead of Stalin, and then what? There will be milions sent to the Gullag, hundred of thousand people will disappear, and the economy will be just the same commando economy as under Stalin. They are both extremist, the difference is, Stalin had a gangster attitude, but the gangster ruthlesness of him would Trosky compensate with near maniacal faith in the communist ideology. For the average Sovjet citizen the Trotsky hell would be the same as the hell Stalin created.

 

[EasternRomanEmpire]

Trotsky became the leader of the Sovjet Union in stead of Stalin, and then what? There will be milions sent to the Gullag, hundred of thousand people will disappear, and the economy will be just the same commando economy as under Stalin. They are both extremist, the difference is, Stalin had a gangster attitude, but the gangster ruthlesness of him would Trosky compensate with near maniacal faith in the communist ideology. For the average Sovjet citizen the Trotsky hell would be the same as the hell Stalin created.

Trotsky was a radical but he wasn't the kind to purge every single person who has a remote chance of deposing him, he wouldn't send that much persons to gulags or purge the army; Trotsky isn't some kind of maniac communist, he's very capable of rational decisions, he wouldn't invade all of Europe just to spread communism, he would only support communist movements; that's better than Stalin, obviously it will still not be the paradise Marx theorized but what do you expect from the Bolsheviks?

 

[the Imperium of Canada]

I'm sure a hypothetical Trotsky lead Soviet Union would do plenty of heinous shit but saying it it would basically be no different than what Stalin did is disingenuous in my opinion.

Him not really being the best political operator could be a factor in him just being incapable of centralizing power around himself to anywhere near the same extent that's Stalin did in OTL, which would probably be greatly beneficial for the Soviet Union in the long run.

 

[CommieScum]

After the October Revolution and during the Russian Civil War, Trotsky was de facto Lenin's second-in-command. At multiple times Lenin offered Trotsky high positions which could've given him the power inside the party to outmanoeuvre Stalin (first deputy of Sovnarkom, Vice-Chairman of the Soviet Union ecc.) and it was likely Lenin's intention to nominate him his successor. Also after Lenin's testament came out Stalin offered to resign but Trotsky, among others, insisted that he remained.

How could've Trotsky made better decisions which would've resulted in him taking power instead of Stalin?

First you need Kamenev and Zinoviev to not redeem Stalin at the Party when Lenin's denouncement of him is read.

 

[Parma]

Trotsky was a radical but he wasn't the kind to purge every single person who has a remote chance of deposing him, he wouldn't send that much persons to gulags or purge the army; Trotsky isn't some kind of maniac communist, he's very capable of rational decisions, he wouldn't invade all of Europe just to spread communism, he would only support communist movements; that's better than Stalin, obviously it will still not be the paradise Marx theorized but what do you expect from the Bolsheviks?

Trotski was a communist, that alone is extreme enough. Defenitly he would sent milions in the slavery Gullag system , his ''buddy'' Lenin started the system. Trosky led the Red Army during the civil war and was sucsesfull manly due to his extrmism and ruthlesness. It would be naive to think that the Sovjet Union would be even marginal better under Trotsky than under Stalin. Or that coomunism would be less expansionist under Trotsky than under Stalin.
I would think a Sovjet Union under Trotsky woul be even more expansionist in Europe and USA than under Stalin and dangerous. Stalin didn't like the possibility that , by exaple a Communist France or Germany would be more succesful than his Sovjet Union.
The communistic system disregard life and individuals. Trotsky would be the same insane dictator as Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot and all the other comunist dictators. Will there not be milions sent in a slavery system as the Gulag than milions will perrish in insane economic and or agricultural experiments.
Lenin, Trotsky are extremist Stalin was more gangster, never the less they disregard life of humans in the name of their extremist world view.

 

[Gar48]

Maybe a Soviet victory during the Polish-Soviet war? OTL Trotsky supported the war, resulting in him and supporters being discretited by the Soviet defeat

ITTL Trosky's "Permanent Revolution" wpuld be proven right by the conquest of Poland and possibly the Baltics, alongside the likely survival of the Hungarian Soviet Republic

 

[CommieScum]

I'm sure a hypothetical Trotsky lead Soviet Union would do plenty of heinous shit but saying it it would basically be no different than what Stalin did is disingenuous in my opinion.

Him not really being the best political operator could be a factor in him just being incapable of centralizing power around himself to anywhere near the same extent that's Stalin did in OTL, which would probably be greatly beneficial for the Soviet Union in the long run.

The structures that allowed Stalin to centralize power were already in place. Stalin was the first to realize the power of the General Secretary post, but it wont take political mastery to realize that the Resolution on Party Unity (1921) effectively makes the authority of the Central Committee ultimate. And if it is a Trotsky wins scenario, I would assume that Kamenev, Zinoviev and Stalin have already been eliminated from the Politburo

 

[CommieScum]

Trotski was an communist, that alone is extreme enough. Defenitly he would sent lijons to the slavery Gullag system , his ''buddy'' Lenin started the system. Trosky led the Red Army during the civil war and was sucsesfull many due to his extrmeism and ruthlesness. It would be naive to think that the Sovjet Union would be even marginal better under Trotsky than under Stalin. Or that coomunism would be less expansionist under trotsky than under Stalin.
I would think a Sovjet Union under Trotsky woul be even more expansionist in Europe and USA than under Stalin and dangerous. Stalin didn't like the possibility that , by exaple a Communist France or Germany would be more succesful than his Sovjet Union.

Well Trotsky wouldn't target minorities specifically in his purges and for gulags, that alone is a massive change. It also means there is no Holodomor. It goes without saying that he would be more expansionist, but its hard to say what that would look like.

 

[Gar48]

Well Trotsky wouldn't target minorities specifically in his purges and for gulags, that alone is a massive change. It also means there is no Holodomor.

Trotsky wouldn't purge the army as well, considering its members were among the few people who actually liked Trotsky

 

[Parma]

Well Trotsky wouldn't target minorities specifically in his purges and for gulags, that alone is a massive change. It also means there is no Holodomor.

He might not target minorities, make him than better? I wonder if there is no Holodomor, there might be even a much larger famine in the Sovjet Union due to extremist agriculture experiments. Milions perrished in China as well due to the policies of Mao and his communist.